Note: Although I often tell readers on my Mah-Jongg Q&A Bulletin Board that I don't withhold information from these FAQs, this FAQ and FAQ 8 (Strategy) are exceptions to that rule. You can find much more information on American and Chinese Official etiquette and error-handling (and strategy) in my book, The Red Dragon & The West Wind. Also see my weekly column for occasional etiquette and error-handling pointers as well.

To be honest, nobody ever actually asks me about mah-jongg etiquette, but the answers below come up a lot -- usually in response to a completely different question. These completely different questions usually start something like, "My mah-jongg group got into a heated argument about..."

When players adhere to certain "rules of etiquette," the result is a friendlier game, a better atmosphere in which to enjoy the game and each other's company.

You don't have to believe me -- and these "rules" (in quotes because etiquette is very different from the rules of a game) are not hard and fast -- but if you try these out, you will see for yourself that an improved atmosphere can result from following these guidelines.

2. Be polite if you are on the receiving end of an unpleasant game event. If you are called dead or have to pay a penalty, accept it. It's just a game, and you want to play with these folks again!

3. Politeness is always good -- be considerate of other players' needs. If another player is having a difficult time concentrating if there is conversation going on, then try to limit conversation during the Charleston and during play. On the other hand, if another player greatly enjoys conversing while playing, and you want her to cut down the conversation, ask politely.

4. If you were playing mah-jongg on the internet and used foul language a lot, you would likely get "booted." So the same thing goes in the real world -- try not to use four-letter words too much, even if the other players are using them a lot. The game would probably be more congenial without those words. Occasionally you may need to have outsiders join in -- what would they think to join a table of "longshoremen"? (^_^)

5. ... oh, the heck with numbered items! Here's part of an article I wrote in the newsletter of the AMJA some time back:

Philosophy #4: If you make a mistake, you are the one who should suffer its consequences, not everybody else at the table. You can ask for, but not demand, a second chance. There is no rule that says, "mistakes must be forgiven by the other players."

Philosophy #5: How to decide when mistakes may (or must) be taken back:

a. When a player makes a mistake that messes up her own hand, and realizes it immediately (before discarding a tile, thus ending her turn), undo the error if the rules permit.

b. When a player makes a mistake that messes up her own hand, and realizes it after discarding, then it's too late, and she must live with the mistake.

c. When a player makes a mistake that messes up the game, and it is realized immediately, the mistake must be rectified on the spot, if the rules permit.

d. When a player makes a mistake that messes up the game, and it is not realized immediately (thus cannot be rectified), sometimes it is best for all players to just throw in their hands and start over.

e. A mistake is committed to when an action has occurred. Merely voicing an intent to do an action does not commit to the action. Beginning to do an action, without completing the action, probably does not commit to the action - depending on what steps the player has performed (as regards to American mah-jongg, see FAQ 19AM for some specific instances in which a change of heart may or may not be forgiven). Completing an action commits one to that action, and may not be undone (with certain overriding exceptions; see the above). (Note: yes, this is vague. It's not a rule; it's merely a philosophical principle to be considered when contemplating whether or not a mistake can be undone.)

f. The above principles can be overruled by a mah-jongg call. Mah-jongg overrules everything.

g. There's an exception to every rule or principle. Including this one.

See FAQ 14 for more about table rules.

And here's more... from another column I wrote for the AMJA newsletter (thus most of this applies mainly to the American game):

BAD MAH-JONGG HABITS... AND WHY THEY'RE BAD

DISCARDING AHEAD -- When I play with my Japanese friends, they yell at me if I claim a discard and then make the exposure before discarding (nobody can play until I discard, and they want to PLAY!). But when I play with my American friends, they call me dead if I discard before making the exposure. One person's bad etiquette is another person's official rule! Why it's a bad habit -- Do it with players who strictly follow the rules (like in a tournament) and you'll be called dead.

PICKING AHEAD -- Many American players think "picking ahead" (AKA "playing with a future") is the correct way to play. But when these players come to a tournament... watch out! Old habits die hard. And picking ahead is the surest way I know to get called dead in a tournament. In case anybody's been living in a cave, picking ahead is a no-no. That other mah-jongg association (I'm not naming names, but their initials are NMJL) HATES picking ahead! Read their rulebook and yearly bulletin sometime if you don't believe me. Why it's a bad habit -- (1) It causes too many conflicts when someone wants to claim a discard. You might think that it makes the game go faster, but it really doesn't. (2) Do it in a tournament and you'll be called dead.

RESTING THE HAND IN THE PLAY AREA -- First time I encountered this was at a recent tournament. One lady habitually would rest her right hand over her rack and in the center of the table. Why it's a bad habit -- (1) Your hand or wrist obscure an area where there might be tiles people want to see. (2) Putting your hand there lets you play faster, which puts other players at an unfair disadvantage. You should play at the same speed as everybody else, giving everyone an equal opportunity to claim discards, on each player's turn. If everybody at your table agrees to rest their hands in the play area too, then fine. Otherwise, you're just being selfish.

LOOKING AT THE PICK IN TABLE CENTER -- Some folks take the tile from the wall and look at it right there, rather than first bringing it to their rack before looking at it. When they do this, I get a glimpse of the tile. And I figure it's not my fault I saw it. Why it's a bad habit -- (1) Other people can see your tile. (2) It increases the possibility of a conflict if someone wants to claim the tile discarded just before you looked at it. Consider -- it often takes folks a second to decide to claim a discard, right? So if you grab a tile really soon after a discard is made, chances are that after you look at the tile somebody will call the previous discard. What if it was a joker? Too bad for you! You have to put it back if the claim was made before you racked or discarded.

FREQUENT EXCURSIONS FROM TABLE -- The appropriate time to get up from the table to get food or drink or whatever is during the interval between hands. Not during play. Why it's a bad habit -- Should be obvious. (1) While you are up, you could easily peek at other folks' tiles. Everybody has to either trust that you won't, or cover their tiles with their cards. (2) Nobody can play while you're up. On each discard, somebody has to holler to you, "Hey, there's a One Crak on the table! Do you want it?" Come on, be considerate of the others, will ya???

EATING -- Everybody eats during mah-jongg (and I for one, am getting overweight because of it). But it shouldn't interfere with the game.

MAKING EVERYBODY WAIT -- It's normal to need a moment or two to think occasionally. But some players make a bad habit of it. If you think you might want a discard, it's OK to say, "Wait a second." But don't stretch it out to a minute. We give you a second and you take an hour? That isn't nice! Say, "Wait a second." Then, within a second or two, make a decision one way or another. And apologize for the interruption if you decide to pass. (By the way, you've also given away a lot about your hand, but that's your problem.) Why it's a bad habit -- when delays are injected into the game, people forget whose turn it was. During a Charleston, somebody thinking too long is the single greatest cause of mixups. The longer somebody ponders, the greater the chances of a Charleston misstep.

KVETCHING (AND ITS OPPOSITE, GLOATING) -- Some players vent their frustrations about missed opportunities and bad luck. That's OK if it's kept to a minimum. But some players make it a lifestyle. (If only Dr. Laura could give these players a piece of her mind!) If all the players kvetch and it's a common trait between them and they all enjoy it, then fine. But then let one of these players win a game, and now they can't shut up about that!!! Why it's a bad habit -- Silence is golden. It lets players think about their own tiles. The world doesn't revolve around you and the tiles it's been your bad luck to have been dealt.

SLIDING DEALER'S WALL LEFT -- After the deal, some dealers like to slide their remaining tiles to the left, butt up against the rack plate. This can cause people to start dogging too early, when they still have a chance of winning. Why it's a bad habit -- When the dice showed a high number, there's no problem, but when the dice showed a small number, there's only a really short wall in front of the dealer. Right? So if you move this short wall all the way to the left, you leave a very long gap between the last long wall and the dealer wall. People often gauge their chances of success by measuring the length of the remaining wall. And if there's a long gap, people might well forget that the last dealer wall is even there. I've even seen this happen to the dealer who did it! She was the one who slid the short wall to the left, and she was the one who destroyed her hand by throwing jokers even though she still had a chance. So as though it wasn't bad enough you could be fooling someone else into dogging their hand, you could even fool yourself.

EXCESSIVE SHUFFLING -- I've met players who have to get the last shuffle in. After they've shuffled and shuffled and shuffled the tiles, if you stick your hand in and shuffle something, they just have to shuffle again. You stick your hand in again, they stick their hands in again. Why it's a bad habit -- This is more amusing than it is annoying.

OVERLY FORCEFUL SHUFFLING -- It is possible to shuffle the tiles gently, so that they all stay mostly face-down. The goal is to mix the tiles up, not to simulate the effects of a tornado. Why it's a bad habit -- When you don't use any finesse in shuffling, you can turn over more tiles than is necessary. More often than not, you'll overturn a joker. Then it becomes necessary to shuffle some more. Turn over even more tiles in the process, and it never stops! Do you want to shuffle, or do you want to play? Also, vigorous shuffling (or tossing them up in the air) shortens the life of the plastic tiles. If the tiles are pretty, wouldn't it be nice to let them stay pretty?

OVERLY FORCEFUL DISCARDING -- Some players like to flick the tile after it's down, to get the tile mixed well in among the others. Forcefully flicking a tile can often cause it to hit the active wall, knocking the wall down and either causing a mixup or exposing something prematurely. And male players in Asia sometimes make a show of slamming a tile down in disgust and/or to declare a win. There's no need for such force. Be careful of the walls when placing discards. No need to jar everyone's nerves. Treat the tiles with a little respect, and they'll respect you.

PATTERN DISCARDING -- Some players lazily place all their discards in a small area right in front of their rack. Why it's a bad habit -- It gives the other players an easy visual record of what you've discarded. Very useful in figuring out what you're doing. Why do you think other folks go to such lengths to make sure all the discards are haphazardly placed?

CARELESS PLACEMENT OF THE DICE -- After the dealer rolls the dice, the resulting number should be preserved when placing the dice aside. (1) The rolled number should be left visible. (2) The dice should be placed to the dealer's right (at the next dealer's left). Most players don't bother. They just scoop the dice and put them somewhere out of the center of the table. Why it's a bad habit -- (1a) Sometimes you need to be able to determine if some misplay has occurred. It is sometimes useful to be able to rehash events, starting with reviewing the number that had been rolled. (1b) Some players like to double the score if doubles were rolled. How are you going to remember that doubles were rolled if you don't preserve the rolled number? (2) Putting the dice somewhere else on the table can cause confusion as to who just dealt and who is supposed to deal next. Who was supposed to take the "first and third" tiles, and who is responsible for this mess I've been dealt???

GAPS IN RACKED TILES -- Lots of players like to put gaps in their tiles, grouping their completed concealed pungs and kongs separate from one another. Why it's a bad habit -- It gives the other players clues about how much progress you are making. You are only hurting yourself. Of course you need to have gaps between your exposed sets.

UNFRIENDLY EXPOSURES -- Exposures atop the rack should be in chronological order (first exposure at your left). You need to have gaps between your exposed sets. The tiles can be oriented facing you, or facing your opposite, whichever you prefer (all should be oriented the same way).

PREDICTABLE PLACEMENT OF JOKERS -- One player I know always puts her picked jokers at the left of her rack when she gets them. It wasn't hard to figure out the pattern, with a little observation. Why it's a bad habit -- It tells the other players how well you are doing. You are only hurting yourself.

TACTLESS ERROR NOTIFICATION -- Use a little tact when you see someone make a mistake. One time I missed the chance to redeem a joker, and didn't even know it. Another player sarcastically said to me, "Hello-o!!" I had no idea what she was telling me. The right way to do it: "Oh, no, Mary. Surely you didn't mean to pass up that joker?" Just be nice. Why it's a bad habit -- You want other players to play with you. Be nice and they will want to.

UNCLEAR TILE ANNOUNCING -- I myself am guilty of snapping a discard on the table simultaneously with announcing the tile's name. The sound of the snap sometimes obscures my words. Some folks mumble their tile announcements. Then somebody has to request an encore. Why it's a bad habit -- The game moves more smoothly when everybody can hear all the tile announcements.

DISREGARD FOR WALL NEATNESS -- Some players stack the tiles along the front of their racks and then don't run a hand along it to straighten it up. The result is a jagged uneven mess that's just plain unsightly. Why it's a bad habit -- Most of the other players are probably "neat freaks." Mah-Jongg is all about creating order from disorder. And here you go flaunting your sloppiness in front of the others. It causes a subtle consternation among the other players. And that's not nice. Give them a little peace of mind and straighten your wall.

CARELESS DISCARDING -- I've often seen players place a discard and not even notice that they placed the tile on its side or leaning against another tile. Invariably, someone else will reach in and lie the tile flat on its back. Wake up, will ya? Look what yer doing! Place the tile flat! Why it's a bad habit -- All players need to be able to see all the tiles lying flat on their backs, face up and readable. Somebody else shouldn't have to tidy up after your carelessness. It would serve you right if they left it that way and it came back to bite you later on.

EXPLAINING HAND TO BETTOR -- When playing with five, and one is a bettor, it's best to remain silent while the bettor is viewing your hand. And when you are the bettor, it's best to remain silent while viewing other players' hands. Some players feel it necessary to explain their hands to the bettor: "I could go this way, or..." (sliding some tiles) "...I might go this way." Some bettors feel it necessary to narrate the process: "Oh, okay, I see what you're doing. Or it could go that way. And your hand... uh, huh..." Why it's a bad habit -- (1) How the bettor sees what you might do is of no consequence to you. Keep your plans to yourself. The other players don't need to know how many ways you might go, or how good your chances of making it are. (2) Certainly when you're the bettor you don't need to give the players any clues about whose hand is better.

IMPATIENCE WITH BEGINNERS -- Some folks have no patience for beginners. They forget, apparently, that they were beginners once themselves. Be nice to beginners and you can enjoy playing with them after they improve their playing skills. Be nice to beginners and they'll want to play with you after they improve.

UNWILLING TO ADAPT TO TABLE RULES -- Every table has their own way of doing things. That's just the way mah-jongg is and always was. The day after mah-jongg was invented, it was played at a second table with a second set of table rules. Your table rules are, of course, the correct table rules. (For you, anyway.) But your regular group isn't the only group you'll ever play with. If you want to play with anybody else, you can't expect everybody else to bend to your way of doing things. You need to be able to adapt to other rules. It isn't hard to adapt -- you just think it is.

"VIEWER-UNFRIENDLY" HAND EXPOSURE -- When you expose all your tiles (when you've won the hand), put your tiles all one way up, put gaps between exposed sets, and put the groupings in the order shown on the card. Make it easy for the other players to see what hand you made. Some folks never bother. Why it's a bad habit -- You want everybody to see what hand you made so you can get the proper score, right? Help them see it.

DISPLAYING THE HAND TOO SOON -- Player A: "Mah-Jongg!" Player B: "Oh, darn. Just LOOK at this beautiful hand!"
How often have you heard that? Some folks just can't help themselves. As soon as somebody goes Out, these folks have to commence the postmortem show-and-tell.
Why it's a bad habit -- (1) It distracts everyone's attention from examining the winning hand. Maybe that was your subconscious intention, but let the winner have the spotlight for a second. She deserves it. (2) What if the winner's hand is no good? Not only is she dead, but now you are too!

NOT LOOKING AT WINNER'S HAND -- After somebody declares mah-jongg, everybody starts the postmortem show-and-tell. "I was THIS close, is that gorgeous or what?" Then they throw in their tiles and start shuffling. Then they remember to ask how many points were earned so they can pay up. Why it's a bad habit -- It's very easy to forget what hand was made. This sort of information is strictly "short term" memory. Calculate the scores, and pay up, while the hand is still up. I was in a tournament once, and the scorekeeper had given me the wrong score despite my telling her three times that I'd made a 40-point hand (30 points on the card, and 10 for jokerless). She'd been so busy with the show-and-tell that she'd never even bothered to look at what hand I'd made. Convincing her to change it after the fact was a lot more work than it would have been if she'd just looked in the first place.

"WHO THREW THAT?" -- When you're paying up, you need to know how much to give the winner. But to ask "who gave that to you" is a somewhat tactless way of doing it. If it wasn't you who threw the winning tile, all you're doing is rubbing salt in the fresh wound of the person who did. Instead, you should say, "How much do I owe you?" (Of course, it goes without saying that it would be even better if you just paid attention, listened when the player announced the score in the first place, and verified the hand against the card for yourself.)

BEING OVERLY STRICT -- When you're playing in a tournament, strict enforcement of the rules is expected and proper. But if you have a friendly group, you can be a little looser with the rules. I know one group that wanted to adopt the strict "you touch the wall tile, it's yours" rule, and another group that says "as long as you didn't look at it, you can change your mind and take the discard." I am adaptable to either rule. The latter rule is more friendly, and I like it better. But when I'm in a tournament, stand back. You touch that tile, it's yours!

LAST ONE: TRYING TO ENFORCE ETIQUETTE ON OTHERS -- I've had a lot of fun here, writing about the bad habits of others. But I don't go around trying to convince everybody to change to my point of view. If I did, I'd probably find myself without anybody to play mah-jongg with. Please don't take this article as a license to try to change peoples' habits. The way to get people to use good etiquette is to use it yourself. Set an example for them to follow. Everybody will want to play with you if you show them how to be a good player.

And here are some pointers contributed by J. R. Fitch (creator of the computer game Hong Kong Mahjong Deluxe):

- Most important: pay attention and play as quickly as everyone else.

- When you are the person whose job it is to serve the wall, don't make others ask you to do it. Pay attention, and when the end of the wall is getting too far from the center of the table, serve the wall to make it easy for others to reach.

- When East loses he should immediately pass the dice and "jong" to the next banker.

- East should remove the dice from the center of the table immediately upon determining the count (just to get them out of the way of those who are grabbing stacks and pushing Walls).

- Also, there is an issue regarding players who discard before they pick from the Wall. This is very agressive and is sometimes banned. Where it does not come under the rules, it is then a matter of manners, right? This style of play is subject to approval by the rest of the table.

- When playing with folks who speak Cantonese, never say: "Say ba paw!"
Why it's a bad habit -- It means:"You mean old woman!". (^_^)

COMMENTS from the Mah-Jongg Q&A Bulletin Board...

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Are they both dead?

On Thursday, February 20, 2020, 06:57:43 AM PST, Susan D wrote:
Are Both Players Dead?
Tom, This situation was posted on Mah Jongg That's It. A player picks a tile from the wall and swaps a Joker from another player. In the process, she hands the wrong tile to the player, and the other player takes the tile and puts it down with her exposure. The players knew that the player who put down the wrong tile with the exposure was dead, but they are wondering if the player who made the Joker exchange was also dead. That player did eventually call Mah Jongg. The players said they threw in the game. What are your thoughts?
Susan D

Good morning, Susan. Just having my morning coffee.
There's nothing in the rules about this. When the rules are silent, we have to consider 2 other things: strategy and etiquette. Make that 3 things: add common sense.
- Strategy says, "the fewer opponents, the better. Give her the wrong tile when asking for a joker. If she doesn't notice, she'll be dead. If she notices, I'll laugh at my silliness and give her the correct tile."
- Etiquette says: "It was my fault that Romeo killed himself so I must kill myself too." (Okay, so etiquette doesn't tell us anything useful in this case, since you can't call yourself dead.)
- Common sense says: "The rules don't say that she who gave the wrong tile for the joker suffers any penalty, and since that's me, I'm good to keep on playing." It also says "The rules say I'm dead because she gave me a poison tile, and that's not fair! Aaaarrrggghhh!" Okay, so common sense differs depending on which side you're on. To the other two players on the table, common sense says: "Those two should both be dead so I can keep on playing." So, common sense aligns with strategy... in this case.
Then there's FAQ 9, where I outline some philosophies that can govern conflicts arising out of errors not covered by the rules. Essentially, FAQ 9 talks about a 4th "thing" to consider in the absence of a rule: fairness. Fairness says both should be dead.
So, it depends: which concept should hold sway in the absence of a rule? Strategy? Etiquette? Common sense? Or fairness?
- Strategy - Only the one who can be called dead under the rules is dead.
- Etiquette - Both of us should be dead.
- Common sense - Both of them should be dead.
- Fairness - Both should be dead.
"Both dead" wins, 3 against 1. But this is just my opinion.
Another opinion: The game would be so much simpler if people would just open their eyes, and stop making dumb mistakes.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Author of the Sloper On Mah-Jongg column and the Mah-Jongg FAQs -- donations appreciated.
February 20, 2020
Los Angeles, California, USA

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How to deal with a slow player?

>From: Tomer, Arlene E
>Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 7:01 AM
>Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
>My mah-jongg question or comment is: In my group of players, we have a few that are especially slow. How can I get them to play faster. They hem and haw on discarding a tile because of the exposures other players have.
>Thank you
>Arlene

Hi Arlene,
I wrote about this in Column 350, but this is such a frequently asked question that I'm going to append this email to FAQ 9. But be advised that you probably won't like my answer.
The only way to deal with a slow player is to talk to her about it, openly, in the group setting. It isn't possible to get her to speed up without letting her know that you want her to. I have given this answer to a number of people before, and invariably they've responded "oh dear, I can't do that." That reaction doesn't make any sense to me, but that's usually been the reaction I've gotten.

First you have to bring up the subject of playing speed to the entire group. I recommend this be done at the beginning of a session, before play has begun. It's possible that you'll get a clear majority supporting your position - if so, then the slow player will see clearly that she must speed up her play else she'll be the odd man out.

It's also possible that you'll discover that you're in the minority - that the majority supports a relaxed atmosphere, one without pressure for speedy play. If that happens, then you know that you have to adapt to their mode of play if you want to stay with the group.

The third possibility is that two of you want a speedier game and two of you want time to think. Your possible courses of action in such a case are limited. You can (a) quit the group and seek players who play at your speed, (b) adopt a more patient attitude, or (c) you can nag the slow players and thereby eventually cause the group to break up from all the discord, meaning, in effect, you're going with option (a).

No matter what you do - speak up or hold your peace, it's vital that you be patient. Even if you get a slow player to agree to speed up, you need to find a way to be gentle when urging her to make her play. I like Marge Simpson's phrase: "This can be fixed with some gentle nagging."

May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on mah-jongg East & West.
MJ溌Sloperama中com
トム·スローパー   /   湯姆 斯洛珀  /  탐 슬로퍼
Los Angeles, CA (USA)
May 7, 2008

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Sandwiching jokers in an exposure

>From: Bev S
>Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2017 11:12 AM
>Subject: Exposing your jokers and proper separation
>Hi Tom.
>I looked and didnt find a rule on this in my book,
>I was taught by a good player, who was into player etiquette.
>When putting up your exposed hand we were told to enclose when possible the joker between the nbrs
>And not to run it into an earlier exposure, so that it was clear just where the joker belonged.
>Is this a rule or just a table rule.
>I always do it. And have taught a lot of players, that it's the correct, and fair way to lay out the tiles.
>If I'm playing in competition, what can I expect, or can I expect this as a stratagie to confuse me in a quick playing game to not know just where the joker belongs?
>Sorry if missed this in the list.
>Bev

Hello, Bev!
Interesting question! You asked:

we were told to enclose when possible the joker between the nbrs
>And not to run it into an earlier exposure, so that it was clear just where the joker belonged.
Yes, I teach my students to always "sandwich the joker" for just this reason.

Is this a rule or just a table rule.
It's not a "rule" at all. It's just common sense. You want the other players to pay you when you win, so you have to let them see your winning hand -- with no confusing tile placement to get in their way of recognizing it. I'm very glad that you teach your students that, too.

If I'm playing in competition, what can I expect
At a tournament, you can expect to find nice people who play intelligently and courteously. You can expect to find terrified newbies who shudder at the thought of making any kind of mistake. You can expect nasty competitive players, you can expect poker faces, and you can expect cheaters.

or can I expect this as a stratagie to confuse me in a quick playing game to not know just where the joker belongs?
What an interesting idea. That thought never occurred to me, and I never saw anyone who was deliberately not sandwiching her jokers so as to screw with the other players. If someone does that, it's easily remedied: just ask her, after every exposure, "please sandwich your jokers."

Sorry if missed this in the list.
I don't know which list you're thinking of. If you're thinking of FAQ 19, since sandwiching the jokers is not a rule, it's not listed there. If you're thinking of FAQ 9, you've raised a good point - that this belongs in there. What I'll do is append this Q&A to the FAQ. Thanks!

May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
トム·スローパー
湯姆 斯洛珀
Creator of the Sloper On Mah-Jongg column and the Mah-Jongg FAQs -- donations appreciated.
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Los Angeles, California, USA
April 6, 2017

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The etiquette around giving information at the table

>From: btayvice
>Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 10:50 AM
>Subject: ediquette re talking about others game
>Hi I am a beginner, but have picked up quickly. Is it proper to announce to the rest of the players that one person will win if you disgard a certian tile, thus alerting all, that one player is very close? The player next to me said I know you need this tile and I'm not passing it on. Would this make my hand dead?
>I can not find anything in my rule book about this.
>Thankyou Bev

Hello Bev,
In Official Chinese Mahjong, it's a punishable offense to give information about a player's hand. But I'm going out on a limb (don't worry, even though I'm a little overweight, it's a very strong limb) and guessing that you do not play that variant. My out-on-a-limb guess is that you play American mahjong instead.
In American mahjong, there is no rule against giving information. That's probably why you didn't find anything in your rulebook. By the way, you never said what your rulebook is...
The only "information" rule in American mahj is the one regarding a player whose hand is dead (or whose hand someone suspects to be dead). But that's not what we're talking about here.
You asked if it's "proper." I would say it's "in bad form" to divulge information about another player's hand while the game is on. I would say that a GOOD player (one with skill and experience) would never do that, because divulging information could reduce one's own edge. If I know something about a player's hand, I want to keep that information to myself so only I act according to that information -- it's fine by me if other players at the table don't know the information. Sounds to me like the player next to you has some sort of compulsive need for people to think she's smart or something.
And no, you can't be called "dead" just because some twit revealed information about what tile you need. It might reduce your chances of making the hand, but if the other players are smart, it doesn't change your chances.
I think I'm going to have to add this "providing information" issue to FAQ 9.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Los Angeles, California, USA
June 29, 2010

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She always wants to look at what I didn't win on

>From: C████
>Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 7:51 PM
>Subject: Asking about another's hand
>Hi Mah Jongg King, (Just want to show my deference!)
>I have a friend that asks to see my hand at the conclusion of every hand, when I am not the winner. If I defer and say I was playing a “3/6/9” for example (not the correct one) she will insist I wasn’t based on one of my discards. I explained to her today that this was my way of politely telling her I did to want to show her my hand. She was undeterred. So I followed up with “it’s bad strategy to show your hand for the variety of reasons.” I think she still thinks I am being rude. Do you have a FAQ on this.
>I thought I had seen it in the past, but have spent several hours searching with no luck. I apologize if a repeat. Thanks so much for your thoughts. C████

Hi, Colleen!
You know this is not a question of rules, but is it therefore a question of strategy? There is a third thing involved, which is etiquette. She is not showing good etiquette by asking to see your hand. And if everybody at the table shows their hands, then you are not showing good etiquette by refusing. If someone asks what I was doing, I tell them. Good relations with other players outweighs any strategic advantage they're likely to get by knowing what hand you were doing, after the fact. Besides, if you ever had a fifth player, you would have to let the bettor watch what you're doing. And the bettor always changes (all your opponents will have a chance to watch you play). I don't see harm in it.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
トム·スローパー
湯姆 斯洛珀
Creator of the Sloper On Mah-Jongg column and the Mah-Jongg FAQs -- donations appreciated.
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Los Angeles, California, USA
April 19, 2018 8:35 PM

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Being observant: poor etiquette?

>From: Marsha C
>Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2018 1:43 PM
>Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
>My mah-jongg question or comment is: Let’s say I pass a Wind and two non-Wind tiles, placing the Wind in middle of the three. Is it poor etiquette to watch the player and see if the player puts the Wind on her rack?

Hi, Marsha!
Great question! It wouldn't be good etiquette to crane your neck,* but nobody can fault you for what your eyeballs focus on or pass over. If somebody sees your eyeballs watch your neighbor, then that person has a wandering eye herself! A cagey player might use her peripheral vision to observe what the neighbor does. Another cagey player might mix up the tiles after picking them up from your pass and before choosing some to keep. And yet another cagey player might assume that somebody is keeping winds if winds are rare in the Charleston. If the first pass contains no winds, the player at your left might be keeping winds. If the first across contains no winds, your across could be collecting winds. If the first left pass contains no winds, then the player at your right could be collecting them.
*I had this fleeting image of the cartoon wolf, you know, the one from the forties and fifties, with his eyeballs flying sideways and up to see the tiles. But I decided not to mention that. Oh wait, I just did.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
トム·スローパー
湯姆 斯洛珀
Creator of the Sloper On Mah-Jongg column and the Mah-Jongg FAQs -- donations appreciated.
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Los Angeles, California, USA
Summer Solstice, 2018

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Does it count as "disclosing a bet" if the bettor watches one player intently?

On Saturday, August 21, 2021, 05:40:48 PM PDT, ahuvas wrote:
Question about the Bettor
Hello Tom,
In the Mah Jongg Made Easy booklet P. 24 Rules for Bettors, it states that
1. Bettor shall not be permitted to disclose a bet.
3. If the bettor interferes with the play of the game in any way, they do not receive the benefits of the bet, but must pay appropriate amount due at the conclusion of the game.
So my question is when a bettor stands behind the person that they bet on and watches them intently would you consider this disclosure or interference with play of the game?
When someone stands behind a player and watches what they are doing I have been 100 % right in knowing who they bet on because to me they are disclosing their bet.
What is your opinion?
Thank you,
Susan from NY

Hi, Susan!
In my games, we have always been careful NOT to give away who's bet on. If I'm the bettor and I'm standing, I'm not standing in one place for long. Once I determine what the bet-on needs, I'm checking out other players' tiles to see where the hot tiles are. Sometimes I just go take a seat when play begins (maybe in a position where I can watch two players' hands, not just one), and maybe I flip through a magazine or my phone until the hand ends.
A bettor could use this "vulture's perch" behavior unintentionally, creating a dead giveaway (as you say), or intentionally, to mislead. Instead of looking at the bet-on's hand, she might be using misdirection. Perching over the bet-on could cause the other players to dog their hands, causing the bet-on to lose. Perching over another player could cause players to throw tiles they don't think the perched-over player needs, thus perhaps throwing tiles the bet-on needs. The behavior is bad either way, and can influence the behavior of the not-bet-on players.
Have you brought this up to the group? Open discussion can lead to group consensus on how the group wants to comport itself. It should be obvious to everyone that perching over one player is misbehavior, whether the vulture is a bettor or even just an interested observer. When someone has perched in any of my games, the perchee invariably growls at the vulture to let them know such behavior is unwelcome. The phrases "do you mind?" and "go away" have been heard.
Play safely and stay healthy. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind," the definitive book on Mah-Jongg East & West.
Author of the Sloper On Mah-Jongg column and the Mah-Jongg FAQs
Donations appreciated
8/21/21
Los Angeles, California, USA

Archive-name: mjfaq09.htm
Newsgroups: rec.games.mahjong; fj.rec.games.mahjong
Posting-frequency: n/a (It's on the web)
Last-modified: June 6, 2001
Version: 1.00

Update log:
July 16, 2000 -- FAQ under construction.
January 18, 2001 -- Incorporated material from my old AMJA newsletter articles
January 26, 2001 -- did a little touchup
March 1, 2001 -- added the rule on table rules
June 6, 2001 -- deleted the rule on table rules (it's its own FAQ now)
Subsequent updates are logged at http://www.sloperama.com/mjfaq/log.html